TCMP Season 2 Episode 3

Should a new pastor lead with a strategy or with who they are? In this episode of They Call Me Pastor, Pastor Don Sanderson and Pastor Kyle Popineau talk about why a pastor's identity as a shepherd, formed in the presence of God, has to come before any vision, program, or growth plan.Don shares how he stepped into a church revitalization at Vista without a game plan: "Don't come with a strategy. Come and love the people." Kyle reflects on planting Legacy Church in Tustin, CA, and what God spoke to him about evangelism, discipleship, missions, and outreach. Together they unpack the seasons every church goes through, why decline isn't always bad, and why pastors are stewards of Christ's church, not owners.In this episode:• Why churches shouldn't call a pastor off one sermon, and what church boards should do instead• Why young pastors should record and review their preaching• Forming your pastoral identity in God's presence, not in church culture• Leading from abundance instead of depletion (2 Corinthians 12:9)• The four seasons of church life: winter, spring, summer, and fall• "Trophies of grace" on Sunday, "ambassadors of mercy" all week• Stewards, not owners: the church belongs to ChristScripture referenced: 1 Peter 5:2–3, Acts 4:13, John 4:34, John 15, Ecclesiastes 3, 2 Corinthians 12:9, 1 Kings 19CHAPTERS0:00 Don's book "They Call Me Pastor"0:52 Welcome: Identity Before Strategy1:20 Electing a pastor off one sermon3:06 Why pastors should record their messages4:03 How Vista handled Don's candidacy5:47 Don't come with a strategy, come and love the people7:46 A word from God vs. a word for our vision9:59 Know the condition of your flock11:14 Identity formed in the presence of God13:18 Every shepherd is also a sheep15:18 Can identity shape strategy?18:55 What God spoke to Kyle in Europe21:01 Planting a church vs. stepping into one23:09 The apple orchard: pruning and seasons25:00 Growth, plateau, and decline26:20 Trophies of grace, ambassadors of mercy27:51 Stewards, not owners29:49 Wrap-up and next episode📖 Get Don's book "They Call Me Pastor" on Amazon and BarnesAndNoble.com: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0HJ6LWR8K/?bestFormat=true&k=book%20they%20call%20me%20pastor&ref_=nb_sb_ss_w_scx-ent-bk-v2_k0_1_24_de&crid=2YEL2ID1GR64Z&sprefix=they%20call%20me%20pastor%20bookIf this conversation encouraged you, share it with a pastor in your life and subscribe for more conversations on biblical shepherding.They Call Me Pastor is a podcast for pastors who want to become better shepherds. We're not CEOs. We're shepherds called to lead God's people toward Christ-likeness.#pastor #churchleadership #shepherding #pastoralministry #churchrevitalization #TheyCallMePastor

Pastor, what do you do when God drops you in a valley of dry bones? In our Season 2 premiere, Pastor Don Sanderson shares 32 years of lead pastor lessons from Ezekiel 37.When God asked, "Son of man, can these bones live?" Ezekiel didn't say "sure they can." He said, "O Lord, you know." Don and Kyle talk about what that answer means for pastors facing tired churches, CEO-style metrics, and people who leave or push back. They cover being stewards rather than owners, why every word from God comes with an instruction, the danger of "DoorDash for the Word," and how a man who threatened Don ended up weeping in his arms outside a hospital.Don's new book, They Call Me Pastor, is a guide to a biblical, Pentecostal model of shepherding. It's headed to print soon. 📖 [link]Where is God asking you, "Can these bones live?" Journal it, then share a takeaway below.Chapters00:00 Welcome to Season 200:28 Don's book They Call Me Pastor goes to print02:01 What Bible college didn't teach me02:17 Ezekiel 37: "Can these bones live?"03:28 Stewards, not owners of the church04:11 Shepherd's Refuge and the John 15 journey06:30 Feed my sheep vs. CEO metrics08:55 A theologian's verdict: pastor, not CEO or celebrity10:04 Helping people leave well11:23 "The people who brought you here won't be the ones you pastor in five years"15:03 Candidating Sunday: 39 people and a crawl to the altar18:08 Obedience: prophesy to the bones19:31 Every word comes with an instruction22:05 Depending on God completely23:37 Doing ministry so well we don't need God (Samson)25:38 "DoorDash for the Word": online church and consumer faith27:51 The man who threatened me, and the hospital call31:16 Not everyone who snips at you is a wolf33:12 What it really means to prophesy34:27 Your next step: journal itListen on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcastsSubscribe for weekly conversations on pastoral leadership.#PastorPodcast #PastoralMinistry #ChurchLeadership #Ezekiel37 #TheyCallMePastor

What is spiritual discernment, and why is it essential for pastors and church leaders?In Episode 017 of They Call Me Pastor, Kyle Popineau and Don Sanderson discuss one of the most important—and often misunderstood—responsibilities of pastoral ministry: hearing the voice of God, recognizing what the Holy Spirit is doing, and leading the church with spiritual discernment.Spiritual discernment is more than identifying problems, judging people's motives, or recognizing spiritual opposition. It's about knowing the heart of God, understanding His timing, and having the wisdom to respond in obedience.But what happens when pastors lose their ability to discern?Too often, churches become consumed with programs, leadership strategies, organizational growth, and ministry trends while neglecting the presence of God. As Don explains, when pastors fail to see correctly, they begin to lead incorrectly.In this conversation, Kyle and Don explore how pastors can develop biblical spiritual discernment through prayer, Scripture, intimacy with the Holy Spirit, and a renewed commitment to shepherding God's people.They also share personal experiences of hearing God's voice, receiving spiritual direction, navigating difficult leadership decisions, and recognizing what God is doing in their congregations.In this episode, you'll discover:- What spiritual discernment actually means according to Scripture.- The difference between spiritual discernment and judging people's motives.- How pastors can recognize the voice and leading of the Holy Spirit.- Why prayer and time in God's presence are essential for effective pastoral leadership.- How to discern God's timing when making ministry decisions.- Why church growth strategies cannot replace spiritual leadership.- How spiritual discernment protects churches from mission drift.- The danger of pursuing manifestations of revival instead of pursuing Jesus.- How pastors can cultivate greater sensitivity to the Holy Spirit.Whether you're a lead pastor, associate pastor, church planter, ministry leader, or someone seeking to grow in your relationship with the Holy Spirit, this episode will challenge you to prioritize God's presence over your own plans.Because effective shepherding doesn't begin with a better strategy. It begins with knowing the Shepherd.CHAPTERS / TIMESTAMPS00:00 — What Is Spiritual Discernment?01:27 — Discernment Is Not Judging People's Motives02:47 — Learning to Recognize What God Is Doing04:56 — It's His Church, Not Ours05:56 — Developing Discernment Within Your Leadership Team07:21 — Seeing Potential in People Others Overlook09:23 — When God Reveals Something Through Prayer11:40 — Hearing the Holy Spirit Before Important Decisions13:21 — The Danger of Leading Without Discernment16:35 — Why Pastors Must Prioritize God's Presence18:26 — Developing Spiritual Disciplines That Strengthen Discernment20:09 — Discernment Through Scripture22:10 — Learning to Pray: "Show Me Your Glory"23:04 — Have Churches Become Comfortable Without God's Glory?25:20 — Recognizing the Shepherd's Voice26:30 — How Spiritual Discernment Prevents Mission Drift28:13 — Discernment During Difficult Seasons29:58 — Restoring Expectation in the Church31:23 — Don't Become Attached to God's Methods32:23 — The Danger of Chasing Revival Manifestations33:16 — Seek the Healer, Not Just the Healing34:16 — Discernment Protects Pastors From Leadership Fatigue35:02 — A Prayer for Spiritual Discernment ABOUT THEY CALL ME PASTORThey Call Me Pastor is a podcast dedicated to helping pastors and ministry leaders become biblically grounded, spiritually healthy shepherds.Hosted by Kyle Popineau and Don Sanderson, the podcast offers practical conversations about pastoral ministry, biblical leadership, preaching, church revitalization, spiritual formation, and the challenges of shepherding God's people.Our heart is to encourage pastors to lead with biblical conviction, humility, and dependence on the Holy Spirit.Have a question about pastoral ministry or need encouragement? We'd love to hear from you.Email: Info@theycallmepastor.comInstagram: @theycallmepastorpodcastSubscribe for more conversations on biblical pastoral leadership, spiritual discernment, church health, and ministry.#SpiritualDiscernment #PastoralLeadership #HolySpirit

Are you pursuing personal growth as a pastor? In this AUDIO ONLY episode, Pastors Don and Kyle discuss what lifelong learning could look like in the life of pastoral ministry. If you've ever felt behind or out of date in the approaches you're taking to ministry, this episode will encourage you and give you some practical ways to advance.

We pick up where we left off, discussing Church Boards and how to lead them in health, even when the budget doesn't match the vision. It's important to note that you can change the culture of your board, you don't always have to replace them. You can lead them to a healthy point.

What does it actually look like to lead a church board well?In this episode of They Call Me Pastor, we dive deep into church leadership, board dynamics, and Spirit-led governance—topics most pastors were never trained for. From navigating difficult board relationships to building unity between pastor, staff, and congregation, this conversation gives practical and spiritual insight for every pastor and church leader.If you’ve ever felt like you were “leading in the dark” when it comes to boards, staff, or structure—this episode will give you language, clarity, and a biblical framework to lead with confidence.This is not corporate leadership with Christian language.This is Spirit-led, pastor-centered leadership.⸻0:00 – Leading without a roadmap: no one trained us for this2:00 – The real challenge of working with church boards3:10 – Why secular leadership models don’t work in the church5:00 – The “arrow” framework for church leadership structure7:10 – The danger of leading like a CEO instead of a shepherd9:30 – The reality of small churches and pastoral leadership10:30 – Lead, feed, protect—not drive the flock11:00 – Why unity matters more than quick decisions12:00 – Trust-building with your board over time14:00 – Vetting and building a healthy board culture16:00 – Structuring boards: oversight, staff, and trustees17:00 – Why churches shouldn’t function like businesses19:00 – When board members become family19:50 – Key principle: pastors and boards shouldn’t be in conflict21:00 – Accountability and vulnerability with leadership24:00 – Using future language to shape vision25:00 – Handling disagreement the right way27:00 – Board meetings are not performance reviews30:00 – Money, stewardship, and trusting God31:30 – Don’t let finances drive vision33:00 – Why slow, steady growth matters more than fast growth35:00 – Structuring effective board meetings39:00 – Pastor vs. chairman: don’t lose the calling41:00 – Why pastors are burning out in leadership roles43:00 – Don’t let present reality kill future faith46:00 – Vision grows when you don’t focus on what’s in front of you48:00 – Leadership is more than meetings—it’s relationships⸻Key Takeaways • Healthy churches are built on unity, not hierarchy • Boards should function as partners, not opposition • Pastors are called to shepherd, not manage • Spirit-led leadership produces spiritual outcomes—not corporate ones⸻Connect with UsFollow for more content on pastoral leadership, church growth, and Spirit-led ministryInstagram: @theycallmepastorpodcastEmail: info@theycallmepastor.com